Should bsuinesses be allowed to refuse service based on sexual orientation?

Tuesday, December 5th

he Supreme Court will hear arguments in a controversial case about the First Amendment and religious freedom in America today. The case of the baker in Colorado who was fined and could face jail time for refusing to bake a wedding cake for a gay couple is not just about making a wedding’s about whether religious freedom allows a business to discriminate based on the sexual orientation of the consumers. Should businesses be allowed to refuse service based on sexual orientation?


Transcript - Not for consumer use. Robot overlords only. Will not be accurate.

All right so your baker and two gay guys command and they washing debate a wedding cake for. They're wearing and you say no it's against our religious beliefs. Is okay. We'll talk about that this hour but Jeff first I wanna mention I I talked last hour we've we played their part of Mary got Christmas darling of the carpenters. And I mentioned it Karen Carpenter just had the purest. Voice. I got a tech Smart personal phone from Susan counsel from the council's Susan Kelso lives in New Orleans. And directly to assist us to show an assistant text me Backus said yes Karen Carter had the purest voice also I wanna correct an impression that I gave. I did say John Mayer was canceled tonight it's it's not just John Mayer. It's dead and company the dairy company it's it's John Mayer which is really interesting outperforming wis. The Grateful Dead. And that has been canceled because I John may year I went into the hospital for emergency. Surgery had had a appendicitis. Also we've got some reports that there's a lot of radar activity. On the causeway. So you might wanna try to speed limit because apparently there are pulling a lot of people over. And you know the cost what has so much money I can imagine what for the coming to the end of the year they try to make budget I can imagine that their their their ramping up to the patrols because they need to generate some revenue. But whatever the reason I just want you to be aware that if you tend to speed on the causeway which by the way is not a good idea. You might wanna slow down it just a little bit here's a Texas says. Today in 98 today in 1791. Composer Wolfgang Amadeus Mozart. Died in Vienna. 1791. Wasn't a dear John Conyers was first elected to congress. I think it's close we've also been talking about John Conyers. The young longtime Democrat from none Michigan who has several retired today as a resigned over tired today and is endorsing his son to replace him. And there seems to be conversation about his legacy. Is this legacy erased because of accusations of sexual harassment. We have seen the legacy of some people in the race because of what they did is this a case where. The legacy. Is a raced. That's something we've been talking about also want to mention that I've put a FaceBook video post on our website don't know what's on our FaceBook page WWL radio. And also on the soda. Screwed on the air. FaceBook page. And it's about this idea that the Supreme Court heard arguments they have ruled yet that comes later. But today they they heard arguments of a controversial case that they weren't sure they were gonna take but they took and I'm glad the Supreme Court did because I think we need definition here. I clearly understand both sides of this argument. I'm a religious person. If you're gay and I disagree with your lifestyle. Well their religious people who don't criticize. BO BUT community. But there are some Christians. Or very critical of tech community. And not not necessarily the people by. The manifestation of steer. What I considered to be clear. Born traits. So a baker in Colorado. Is fine and this is going all the way to the Supreme Court. For refusing to bake a wedding cake for. A gay couple that came in order to wedding cake and a guy say that they were just really distraught they were shocked they stormed out of the place one of admits that he cried in the in the in the parking lot. You know I can't. Speak for somebody like that plagued. You know the bottom line is if some business doesn't wanna do your business. And you go somewhere else. But I also believe in this is my opinion. That if you're in business in America. You don't discriminate. You serve everybody. And as somebody who grew up as part of the baby boomer generation that's something I learned a long time ago. That was something that really came alive. When my generation was just coming of age. The idea that you don't discriminate. In fact it was the baby boomer generation back in the sixties that rebellious anti establishment generation. That really fought hard for equality. And did not judge based on gender sexual orientation race or or relation. And an in a lot of ways that generation has changed and fuel to. A lot of the divide that we have in this country and a lot of the judgment. There we have against. Against others. Should businesses be allowed to refuse service. Based on sexual orientation. That's a pretty general people give your opinion by going to our website WW dot com. This is also what a topic of discussion here in Louisiana because governor John Della Edwards is part of a battle. Two to try to odd to change things. Because as it stands now I don't know all the specifics. But as it stands now. When it comes to state contracts and state work. Businesses. Can discriminate. Against the LG BT community. And one. I understand that this is about your religious beliefs but that's why this is such an interest in conversation. Because it really comes down to our conversation about how far can you go with your religious police. To tell somebody else how to lead your life. I understand the guy look this guy wants a bakery I mean he seems like a really really nice guy. And he he said that. He beat would be willing to bake cookies sort cupcakes or Ted Forrest just things like that for it for the wedding. But just couldn't make the wedding cake because it's against his religious police. While I appreciate that. I think if your business in America. You don't discriminate. It's a simple. And there were people who use their religious police in the past two discriminated against African Americans. Mixed couples. If you wanna join us for the comments on numbers 2601870. Every coach 5042601878. Text is a 77. For Mississippi Chad welcome to our show. Gory. Sport and I think. Why am. I. Religious person I mean. Yeah. Big big news I am in labor. And it. Too. So someone. And I'm in. It or is. I satanic. Cult. Couple communion. And into. It and cat and he's. Christian. If. Well may be first of all it would do a lot we depend on how graphic he he gets with cakes I mean maybe that's something out of the realm of what that particular baker does but if it's within the realm of forty does I'm gonna stay consistent Chad yeah yeah yeah yeah you have to make that you have to make the case because your business. Eighteen does he get a break. And Ian. I don't agree Christian. Discriminating and you can't beat. The court and they're. It's pretty much. And this thing. State. Should he choose. To take them Jesus Christ. If you're in the business to make cakes I'm gonna stay consistent to say yes if it's within the realm of what he does some takes a more creative and others. If he doesn't do graphic cakes you shouldn't be forced to do something that began as out of your realm of artistry but if that goes along with what he does he that person should back to take. What I'm even if he well I'll bite BK. What chance so the point is if if if somebody is so religious like remember the woman who worked at the clerk of courts office and in Tennessee. A ticker name was Kim Davis Tennessee or Kentucky I forget yes well you know if if he if you're collision doesn't allow you to perform your job then find another job. A I had that we don't we don't we don't allow him just to discriminate based on gender. He might he might hate women but he can't discriminate against women or African Americans. At. That. This thing. And yeah. You and you and thank me and Shannon. If you got women. Are getting dark and well boy I. Your rewrite your guess this would probably suffer by an end in 98. But. They. Well there are people in the south there keep Chad there are people in the south that would applaud a business that discriminated against African Americans. Actually. Chad I've got to get to a break seed this is why this is an interesting conversation. If you wanna join us with your comment on numbers 26 cell. When he sanity. Text number 87870. All right so two guys come into a baker Colorado. Hey we're getting married too much to make our cake. In a very nice way. The baker says it's against my religious police guys I'm I can I can't do it how many cookies and cupcakes. Which I don't know I guess that's kind of a vicarious supported a celebration anyway I. I think this is a great discussion it'll continue when we come back and Debbie if you well. Yeah it is seems like this battle over the wedding cake is just part of a continuing battle against us same sex marriage and I'm not here to change your religious beliefs but. It seems to me that time at some point where somebody else does in the privacy of their own life is none of your business I Jack Phillips is the baker from from Colorado. And this is this thing going on for five years you know you and I've been talking about this for a long time and the Supreme Court finally today heard arguments. In this so wedding cake case. Should businesses be allowed to refuse service based on sexual orientation that's a pretty general opinion poll 56%. Say yes. 44% say no. Give a sure opinion by going to WWL dot com let me answer a couple of checks that are like this when Tom how please read. No service. God knows no shirt no shoes no service. That's different because you've got the same standard for everybody. It's different when you picked somebody out for a reason like. Race. Religion. Or sexual orientation. The standard news. You have to have ushered on in shoes on but beyond that you can't discriminate. So that's that's the difference there. On it for those who on. Think that you know you can refuse service you can't refuse servers but not if it comes to discrimination. For example if if you worked at a pharmacy type store war. And somebody wanted to come in and by the morning after pill. And you refuse to serve at 2%. To. Should you be far. Do you have that right. Somebody comes in it's a small community you know somebody's not married or how about this. In the coming to buy condoms. Are you facilitated the affair. Isolate them condoms. Can you withhold selling them condoms based on your religious beliefs that's why this is an it was a question. From Kennard Donny your Honda VW well. I'm gonna. Hello wolf ought. That it. There are people out. Of it that there but there. All they want it that you warrior ordered. It. Awkward uses. Maybe to help out at me I know about it the right at the front right. So. If he'll go out and Gary wrote. The de me. Like he did like that. And it's out of pocket bake you cake but we want to at the why he's in trouble. Express and it only. Donny and it's the same principle he goes back to those business owners that didn't wanna serve blocks. We hit yet aren't there and there are I don't agree with that either you know back in the day what occurred. It'd be cool great you know what. Well I mean against the the precedent didn't hear that the precedent is set for us to be. Society where businesses do not discriminate. And as if you were so hell bent on not serving some people for whatever reason. Then you mean you don't have to be in business and being this is in America's choice. An odd then that it completely you know that. It is kind of the dark great beauties what does the it if you look at it or are. You know. And Demi don't you think it don't you think it also comes back to may be and I'm I'm gonna give this guy Jack Phillips of secreted I'm gonna I'm gonna say that he believes that. That he is a sinner if he makes the cake for them because of his beliefs about. Homosexuality. And so made some people feel like I know I'm that I'm the sinner if I do this in its money Christian responsibility to not. Sell this this to that but stand. You're picking and choosing the sentence because he doesn't care obviously disguised not gonna care if a young couple is having sex. And they wanna get married or having premarital sex. They won again when he can he's doc and discriminate against those sinners. Correct and I completely agree. Or do you go get the U. Would not be worth a dispute and would. You well yeah appreciate. All right Johnny Ive I appreciate your call an Emmy I'll also say that look I understand that this guy doesn't want to do not understand the argument that look this is my religion I don't wanna do this. But at some point too because of religious expression not only yours but somebody else's religious expression. At some point we suspend. Our religious beliefs. It in in some aspects of society. And one of those C is in the area of discrimination. And I'll be consistent it is the same principle. That is behind serving. Muslims if you did more to serve a Muslim. If you wanna serve blacks in the past or even today. If you don't wanna serve. Somebody with which tattoos or some kind of real edgy look with the butcher piercings and plug scenarios that you don't serve them because the way they look that that's not allow. Now you could have basic standards in your business but those standards have to transcend. Everything else. In other words if you don't have assured on whether you're straight or gay you don't get service. But if you have assured on you get service with the straight or gay. If your hole stay with us this conversation continues right after the news on derby and he well. Tom Petty hard raiders Chris is all over again yes it is I don't doesn't feel like it right now but it's gonna feel like a later. And it's gonna feel like it tomorrow we've got a cold blast coming down here should businesses be allowed to refuse service based on sexual orientation. 52%. Say no but 40% say yes give us your opinion by going to WW real dot com. Here's a text that says it's screws so if I took a kkk rove to a dry cleaners that is minority owned. And the owner refused to clean it. Would that not be a violation. I beg to ask what the difference per day. Actually there'd be no difference. If your business. You serves customers. And you don't cherish a customer based on. I guess I mean. Munich. You know but let me let me just make this distinction. It's not fair to compare the kkk. To the LG BT community. When you look at the history the LG BT commuting his for the kkk. There's no comparison. But in series. If you're in business you serve the customer. From Gonzales Michael here on WWL. Yeah I'm good. It seemed do you. Just aren't like this. Basically state and I urge you. And I believe we bald spot short daily and polish or gotten. And Cink and only one. So. You know are. You. It was not destroy our guy he is. About. That I doubt that it was. We. Are on board this story out more. About it. I got. Were. High. We. Should all that. What. Are. People. It may be a Marriott well. I thought. They'd be yet. To discriminate. Let me call it discrimination or your service. And they. No they don't that that's not that's not something that has been determined they don't have you can. You can you have the right to refuse service based on other factors are not based on discrimination. Well. I think side. Is it not a state the other the right to do refuse service. And what's coming what tummy tummy when business it's in. Well. Okay. There's been a lot. I don't know all of the op. Many of many I'm Lori in many of them are in bark but that is directed at an a human beings behavior. Abnormal behavior violent. Aggressive threatening behavior it's not based on religion. You can't mean you can say you can put up a sign that says. We are reserves the right to refuse service but you can't reserve the right to refuse service to a Muslim or an African American. Well. Or. Obviously. And make. Up and they would be entirely so. And at the net that are worried comic. Or. Do. I. If they if they want to say if they wanted to they certainly could Michael let's let a guy I've got to get to a break here but let me just explained this and let me explain this this other scenario. There are convenience stores. Tehran by Muslims. And they don't sell any alcohol. But they don't sell any alcohol to every one. So that's it that's it that's a general standard. The problem is when you pick and choose who you're going to serve that's when you get into a problem when it comes to doing business in America. I'll give algae being in and out audience for. You know any referred to have been I never these elegy BCS. You know what this straight. Don't have anybody. Well on their. We continue the conversation. A 2601 a seventy area code 50426. No 170. Tex oversee 7870. There is a video blog out on this on our own FaceBook page WWL radio. And also the odd sort of SO TA scooter in the air a FaceBook page. And there's always. He's conversation going on about those those video blog so. I checked that out I'm still coming back on W zero. Why is freedom of religion is so complicated in America I'm scoot glacier where this this afternoon from Hammond re welcome to the show. Varied hours and I'm good. Dot a very good suggestion. Well solved the problem. And the question for you to know the price for all. Bart. Preamble there's. Concept army artistic expression. Is apart are alert right. I would Susan yes okay so you're being artists. Are we take orders to news. In question are Colorado gentlemen. Or decided to put. This short. Break your carry on our because I believe. That scriptures. From the Bible that say. That's speak against. Sex between people aren't sacks. Well what are bad that as part of my good tickets will be all their financial about why would a parent. As with the woman it's an abomination. You know on note you know what though there's a lot of stuff in the bibles it's an abomination to attempt peoples do every day like he crossing shopping on the ticket if you if you if you wanna take it literally -- we can we can do that I think you've got to stampede crawfish aren't just. Correct while I understand the point you're making that. Item in the world so wait no the problem is. Hi this couple is trying to order cake the way they wanted and they're not getting it the way they wondered if there's scriptural content that denounces our. Right now but again we're talking about pitched well also disagree about artistic expression and number Q second question about that question for you. Earlier gentleman spoke about. The fact that it complex clay and went out summit to bring in a world look good player when broke into a minority owned business. Would they be required should clean network and a rancher and besides other things in certain regards Jude. The difference between the LG EG community air and Kirkland what that would be a proper don't let them provocation what it because obviously. If you were bringing back wrote in true. They are this it would be too. I think that's a record I mean if you didn't live in the neighborhood and you suddenly decided to do business with that minority business and you we're gonna bring in your sheets in your your kkk robe. That might be seen as a provocation and direct. And the call vote was tension in the Carol for abortion in South Carolina. Parent boot maker it. Both. Christians were shot out. Typically to create a provocation. Because of this issue. You know it's an interesting point but I still badly. No it isn't it. It's OK AD it is effective but the factors remain I mean if I have to go back and saying okay we you know what. Then depending on on the fact it is a provocation now with the kkk robe. I'm gonna stay consistent say if you're a minority businesses summary brings you the kkk robe if your business you clean the role. Some provocation and detention wreckage and the power. There were these questions were specifically. Sought out. It's all of their Christian. But it was like I could probably. Ray I understand the torture making but I don't think it's like of violent provocation they're trying do I even if their truck took I'm not for making points. But if you're trying to make a point. I'm why why give them ammunition by not doing your job that's what this comes down to it comes down to do aren't. I don't problem if to artists and I was required to do something. Or are certain sex couple. I would say oh you're on whether to require a report this market charge extra for. Well no they wouldn't have to I would well that was vets of that. Race. You don't have the right to discriminate. You have a right to artistic expression but you don't have a right to put something on a cake that somebody has won on the cake you're not doing business. And if you don't want to do business in America which is a choice and don't do this if you don't have to own a business go work for somebody. If you're a whole stay witness will be right back on deputy well. You know you're talking about this idea of a provocation. It depends on the degree to provocation and the caller who said if you go into a minority. Our own cleaners with our kkk vote that's provocation. Well in some ways it would that you would be provoking somebody. To some degree in the same way that the caller was trying to provoke me into the conversation. So we do provoke each other but the degree of provocation we determine whether or not something is. Allowed or not and I got a text here that says on scoot your flat out Communist. You love regulation again the constitution protects you from the government. Not the bakery. If I thought this person really knew what the definition of for communism was I would tell honor they. And there's attacks. And bites if you read the bill writes. I maybe you haven't done that you know there's a constitution there's also the door price. And the bill of rights on gives individuals. It supersedes minority rule I'm sorry majority rule the bill of rights gives every individual. Equal rights in America. And I'm consistent I think that extends to. Gays the LG BT community. Most let's. I think it extends to conservatives and liberals and men and women and Catholics and Jews I think it extends to everybody. So I'm consistent with this this is not promotion of gay marriage although I'm very much in in favor effect. I just don't think it's any in my business to tell two consenting adults what they can and cannot do. But this is a much bigger conversation about how far you can go with your religious rights. Can you use religious beliefs. To discriminate. Against somebody. And the idea putting scripture that defies. The the concept of homosexuality. At depth for putting them on on a cake. That's discrimination. Because you're not putting it on everybody stick. And I just don't understand why some people are so. Quick to decide which sinners in their minds they're going to air discriminated against while serving other senators. If you're Arnold say witness for coming right back and every if you else.